HomeMy WebLinkAbout11-15-07 MINUTES P L A NNaR 1 0%3" Cqo"O M M I S S 10 N
MINUTES
-t
Regular Meeting — November 15, 2007 - 6-30 pm.
Council Chambers, City Hall; 1501 Truxtun Avenue
1. ROLL CALLA
Present: Commissioners: has n, Andrews, McGinnis, Stanley, Tragish, Tkac
Absent: Commissioner: Billy
2, PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE:
3. PUBLIC STATEMENTS:
None.
4. CONSENT CALENDAR;
.....................4.1 Non-Public Hearing items hone,
4.2 Public tearing items
4.2a Approval of Extension of Time for 'Vey Tentative Live Tract MaI2 551.7 (McIntosh
Associates)
4.2b &12roval of ExtensioLi of Time forVesting Tentative Tract MaR 639 (Delmarter and
iefel Engineenffig)
4.2c ARproval-of-Continuance of Vesting Tentative Tract-Ma 7027 to DecelDber 6, 2007
(Rick Engineering)
4.2d Lkj2p rvari of Amended f=inal Tract Map 62g9, (Higher Ground Eng. & Land
Surveying)
4.2e A1212roval of Vesting ti T t tive Tract a 6465(New Vision Civil Engineering, Inc.)
4.2f A212roval of Continuance, Vesting Tentative Tract Ma t Decemb2r 6,.2007
(McIntosh &Associates)
No one from the public or the Commission requested removal of any item from the
consent calendar. The public hearing is closed on these items, except for Items 4.2c and
4-2f.
Commissioner Tkac moved, seconded by Commissioner McGinnis to rare the
Consent Calendar items as reed=
Motion unanimously carried by the following roll call vote:
AYES: Commissioners: Johnson, Andrews, McGinnis, Stanley, Tragish, Tkac
NOES: Done
ABSENT: Bli'le
P"'lanning Commission - November 15, 2007 Page 2
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5. PUBLIC HEARINGS—Amended Final Tract Ma ting Tentative Trams
5.1 Amended Final Tract a 6229, Phase 1 (Higher Ground Eng. &Land surveying)
Heard on consent calendar.
5.2 Vesting Tentative Tract Map..6 (New Vision Civil Engineering, Inc.)
Heard on consent calendar.
5.3 Vesting Tentative Tract Ma 6760 (McIntosh &Associates)
Heard on consent calendar.
6. WORKSHOP:
"Planning to Avoid Conflagration" Presentation by City of Bakersfield Fire Department.
Mr. Weirather stated that in preparing for this presentation he thought of a story his father used
to tell about a farmer that had a stubborn rule, he tried to pull and tug to get the mule to move
to no avail, as he went through his ordeal a neighbor carne by and offered to help him out and
he explained to the farmer that he had to be kind and gentle to get this mule to perform for you
and the fanner agreed and thought #'l will let him have a chance", and when he did so this
neighbor picked up a fence post that was laying on the ground and cracked the mule right
between the eyes, the farmer looked up and said "wait a minute, stop, and protested stating I
thought you said you had to be kind and gentle" and the neighbor said you do but fiat you have
to get their attention. Mr. Weirather went on to say that a few weeks ago we had quite a few
fires in Southern California, we had some tremendous losses and he asked Jinn Movies for an
opportunity to address the Commission to give a little bit of background, and some of the newer
Commissioners, on some of the factors that influence wild lard fires and the factors that
influence the suppression of these fires. Mr. Weirather stated that this is what he felt he wanted
to discuss and give the Commission an opportunity to ask questions.
,several factors that influence gild land fires are: Breather, fuel and topography.
Factors that influence suppression of fires are: resources, personnel, equipment and such,
types of construction, access and time.
Weather conditions that raise a red flag are extremely lour humidity (less than 20%), higher
temperatures (greater than 900) and grind conditions. In Southern California they have the
Santa Ana wind conditions these are extreme conditions and as these factors intensify the
dangers increase and can increase exponentially. The Santa Ana grind conditions of 70 miles
per hour and drying conditions of humidity of less than % are very explosive conditions and
under those conditions the fire would move much like a Tsunami would move from the ocean
like a massive wave and very difficult to control. The fire department has done an outstanding
ding
job in limiting the losses to just a fear thousand homes where it could have been hundreds of
thousands of homes that could be lost. So they really need to be recognized for those efforts.
Fuels are grasses in our foothills. They are light gasses of varying heights depending on the
amount of moisture we get but range from a few inches to three or four feet at most, it is not
very frequent to see and l wound say averages about 1 to 2 feet in height. They burn very hot
and very fast. Burning time is short. Anything in the gray of these grasses that is combustible
will be ignited from these fires because of the intensity of the heat.
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Planning Commission November
Brush burns hot but slower than grasses. Burning time is much longer than grasses so if an
item life a fence is exposed for a longer period of time it will catch on fire. This type of fire also
has a vertical dimension as it is taller, puts out a wider plane spread and has a lot more radiant
heat.
Timbers, while we don't have a lot in our foothills as communities develop more trees and plant
life are added to mix. If the City follows the Hillside Ordinance there will be more fire resistant-
type vegetation and hope that you keep that in mind in your reviews. These burn much slower
and are more difficult to get started but they can move up. There is a laddering effect, in the fire
department, in gild fires instances and are the stair-steps of a fire starting from grasslands,
moving up to brush and then up to timber. However, it can also ladder up to improvements.
Grasses can move up to wood fences, trash, debris and they can move up compounding the
problem. So that is hoer the structures involved are affected by the grass iand fires and how
they actually become involved is through this laddering effect. Grass itself next to a structure is
not as likely, if it has any type of fire resistant exterior, to catch on fire. However, if you had a
laddering effect with a wooden deck, wooden fence or piles of firewood near the home there
could be some effects with items catching the structure on fire.
Topography comes more into play more now since we into the hillsides for the most part
Bakersfield is mostly flat our hills are not that steep but they do pose conditions and when you
have wild land fires you see in gullies a chimney effect. The chimney effect is taking the
burning material which is at the lower end of the canyon or hillside and funnels it up through the
canyon and preheating the materials. When it is preheated it burns much quicker and much
hotter in a short period of time but it can have a dramatic effect and we can see flame lengths
30; # from fairly short fuels.
Aspect doesn't come into play to much in the flat land, aspect is the way the sun hits a hillside
or mountainside. North aspects usually the moisture stats a little bit longer, you have denser
fuels and at different times of the year, the south, east and crest aspects, depending on the time
of day when the fire starts, can have dramatic effect. Mr. Weirathe- pointed out that he wanted
the Commission to know v that the aspect of a community in a hillside-type environment could be
significant.
Resources that influence a fire are personnel, firefighters and volunteers, equipment as simple
as a garden hose or as complex as an air tanker, these are all the tools that we used to
influence a fire. Water supply is basic and they have piped grid systems, as well as static
systems. Mr. Weirather pointed out that static systems would include lakes, ponds or a
swimming pool but we would have to get the water out and those aren't very accessible. He
also stated that static sources are good to have when there are seismic areas, such as we have
here, when the pipes brew, as they did in San Francisco in early goo#s and the water supply is
eliminated and the fire department had virtually nothing to fight the fire with. Static sources are
certainly something we should consider.
Mr. v eirather Mated that we often hear about combustible construction, wood roofs, different
types of sidings there were some interesting articles in the newspaper about different types of
construction, supposedly non-combustible types of materials and he thins they need to take
into close consideration because they can be very misleading. If you look closely at the some
of the photos in the southern California fires in Rancho Bernardo they saw stucco hones with
the roofs burning very well, so those aren't always conclusive and don't always work and it just
depends on the types of conditions.
Planning Commission - November 15, 2007 rage 4
Mr. Weirather pointed out that access is not just the way into a community but also the means
of escape, especially if there is a large conflagration type scenario where a lot of people have to
be evacuated. When this occurs time is of the essence and the Fire Department works in
minutes not hours and a few minutes one way or the other could really make a difference in the
losses that we will endure. He also pointed out that access deals with slopes, grades, road
surfaces being paved or unpaved, speed bumps, road widths, overhead clearances and
security gates. Mr. Weirather stated that security gates are a big issue and when the fire
department is faced with a gate it is going to slow them down. He pointed out that the fire
department has taken some action with opticon Systems, which are like automatic gate
openers and they are trying to place them in appropriate areas so that they do not compromise
the security, but we do provide for the safety in the event of an emergency=
Mr. Weirather pointed out that time is of the essence and very basically the shorter the time
frame to act the smaller the losses and the smaller the resources necessary to control the
problem and that is what their goals are Some basic conclusions are that there is very little we
can do about Breather, fuel and topography those are pre-existing conditions, we can modify
therm slightly with fire breaks and the like. What we can make improvements on is training and
keeping our equipment in good condition and we can improve our grater sources and supplies
so that we have adequate available grater that we can get to quickly and not a long period of
time. We have alternatives to mains, we have static sources that we could possibly tap into if
we have a severe earthquake. Improving access routes would hopefully reduce response time
and help us in getting to where we need to as quickly as possible and finally to continue
enforcing our codes and ordinances, they are in place and we need to be diligent in keeping
those current and be willing to make improvements to address the challenges that we face. Mr.
Weirather thanked the Commission for their time and asked if any Commission had questions.
Commissioner Tkac inquired if Mr. Weirather was satisfied with the slopes in Bakersfield and
exactly where they are based on the equipment they have now or ghat were going to be doing
in the hills in the future. Mr. Weirather responded that there have been some challenges with
the foothills and referred to the hillside ordinance which originally was a fire document. He
pointed out that very little was charged in that document. he also pointed out that they have
policy on percentage of grades, which is normally % and sometimes they go up to 10% in
extreme conditions.s. He gent on to further point out that one of the issues that continue to be a
challenge is secondary access. If you have been on a number of structure fires, as I have
throughout my career, it usually draws a crowd and when we have those types of conditions
and makes it makes it difficult for the Fire Department to get to the structure and cul-de-sacs
are notorious for clogging up. Mr. Weirather Mated that they have been happy with the gray the
Planning Commission has addressed the sloping issues and secondary access issues which
are very vitally important.
Commissioner Tkac inquired if clear cutting or cleaning the forest bed would have helped the
Southern California fires and if it would relate to anything in Bakersfield. Mr. Weirather
responded that under the recent Southern California conditions they were looking at extreme
conditions and a 30' firebreak would not have made any difference to those fires. He pointed
out that those types of fires move at extremely fast rates and the fire department is equipped to
handle house fires or a large commercial building fire, but if you get the conditions that were in
Southern California you are looping at a tremendous spread of fires and it takes a long time to
get all the resources together to address the issues, which is where the time factor comes into
play. He also pointed out that our fire fighters are commended by other states at what
California Firefighter can do and feels that they are well seasoned.
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Planning Commission - November 15, 2007 Page 5
Commissioner Tkac inquired if the fire department has enough proper equipment and is it on
the cutting edge of staying ahead. Mr. Weirather responded that they have excellent equipment
and it's in good condition but equipment is always a continuing factor.
Commissioner ka inquired ghat the number of firefighters is per capita for the City. Mr.
Weirather responded that they would always life more firefighters to be prepared, as it is not if
it's going to happen, but when it's going to happen.
Commissioner Tkae inquired if there is still training in schools for prevention. Mr. Weirather
stated that they do have a public information officer, whose duties are at the level of a Battalion
Chief and they deal with public information. Mr= Weirather pointed out that there have been a
lot of advancements made in public education.
Commissioner Tkac inquired if there is anything the City can do with technology to get water to
the fire department faster or if he is satisfied with the water that is available for the area. Mr.
Weirather stated that they have a good grid system and the water systems are established by
our ordinances. He stated that even before construction begins he goes out to the tracts to
inspect then because the construction phase is very vulnerable to having fires. He stated that
the way water is distributed is going to need to be addressed eventually and that's the use of
residential fire sprinkler systems and there is a cost factor involved* He stated that he thinks
Bakersfield is a little behind the curve as 2/3 of the State have residential sprinklers are a
common issue. They are a proven system of addressing fires and as our budget and firefighter
staff gets smaller fire sprinkler systems will need to be addressed.
Commissioner Tragish inquired as to policy and ordinances that address the setbacks of orange
groves from oil facilities. Mr. Weirather responded that those types of facilities, industrial sites,
oil well sites and tank farms are required to have clearances of natural growth, trees, brush and
grasses. Within the City limits the Fire Department does go out annually and inspect all those
sites and the setback is typically 30-40 feet.
Commissioner Tragish further asked if there are ordinances, within the City, that delineate ghat
the setback have to be, such as a guideline. Cllr. Weirather responded that there are
ordinances that he can provide but does not have copies with him now and said that
Commissioner Tra i h could call hire and he would give him the information at that time. Mr.
Weirather also pointed out that there are some things which are not visible such as
underground pipelines which also have setbacks because of the concern with leakage relating
to natural gas.
Commissioner "ra i h asked if the facility is located in the County would the requirements be
different, Mr= Weirather replied that the ordinances are ,Mate ordinances, or rather codes, and
they apply to County and City with the City's guidelines and ordinances tending to be a little
stricter.
Commissioner Tragish asked if the County has any of their corn ordinances regarding this and
Mr. Weirather replied that they d .
Commissioner Tragish inquired if the State agency that deals with this would be the DOG, to
which Mr. Welrather responded in the affirmative.
Commissioner McGinnis inquired who is policing the dumping of trash over the ride line with
respect to the Hillside Ordinance, to which Mr. verather responded that Code Enforcement
usually handles geed abatement issues and because of their heavy work load he is unsure if
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Planning Commission ,, November 15, 2007 Page 6
they have addressed this specific issue. He referenced the ladder effect mentioned earlier to
which Commissioner McGinnis agreed with the ladder effect taping off in that area.
Commissioner Johnson stated that the things that really stood out to hire about the Hillside
Ordinance were the fire protection issues. With respect to static water supply, he inquired as to
some examples. Mr. Weirather explained that static water supplies are lakes, ponds or
stationary tanks, but don't really have transitional methods as piping would under pressure. He
stated that the advantage to static systems is that it does provide a source of water that usually
is not dramatically affected by seismic activity. He also pointed out that the City has a small
amount of static sources and it is something to ns d r because we are in a seismic area. H
commented mented that the southwest needs to be considered for more static grater supply as there is
to be more development in that area.
Commissioner Johnson inquired if the City, being the 11 largest City in the State, is actively
pursuing any new alternatives for greater static storage. Mr. Weirath r responded not at this
tin . Commissioner Johnson inquired if this presentation will he given to the City Council, to
which he responded that he was not sure and Commissioner Johnson responded he thought it
would be a good idea.
Commissioner Johnson inquired what the typical response time is for a fire engine company, to
rhich Mr. We rath r responded that within the City their goal is sic minutes and they have been
successful at reaching that goal.
Commissioner Johnson inquired if there are things like light synchronization or special
techniques that can he used or upgraded that would assist in ease of travel to fire destinations.
Mr. Weirather responded that technology has come a long way and the Opticon System is like a
door opener, it allows therm to change traffic signal synchronization temporarily and they are
now adding this to private gates and this doesn't only benefit fire fighters but also ambulance
responses. He also pointed out that the concepts of walking communities where by street
widths are narrowed, as cell as speed humps, pose a hindrance on their response time. He
stated that we really need to maintain the 30' width on streets for private and public streets to
compensate for obstacles in the roadways.
Commissioner Johnson inquired if some of the more stabli hed neighborhoods are using the
pticor System, to which Mr. Walker responded that all of the signals in the City have the
pticon System that were put in in coordination with the fire department over the past several
years. He responded that they have ° compliance and it is very effective in reducing
response times for emergency vehicles. Mr. Walker pointed out that the Opticon System is
spotty in the County and on the State Highway there: are only half-a-dozen of the signals, such
as 2e Street and on Rosedale Highway, Frith the system.
Commissioner Johnson referenced the reverse -1-1 system used in the recent San Diego
evacuations and inquired if it is being used in Bakersfield. Mr. verather responded in the
negative and pointed out that he thinks it is an effective tool for getting communication out, as
well as possibly a cell phone system.
7. COMMUNICATIONS,,
None.
8. COMMISSION COMMENTS:
None.
Planning Commisslon - November 15, 2007 Page 7
9. ADJOURNMENT:
There being no further comments} the meeting was adjourned at 6:22 p.m.
/- M S D. M I S, Secretary
m .
,,/-JAMES
Director
November 29,2007